Although the original topic of the Evolution as “Science” Debate focused on biological evolution, portions of the debate delved into geology and paleontology. Specifically, humanist MR brought up arguments concerning radiometric dating and the order of the fossil record. These are common arguments that are based on falsified assumptions. I share this portion of the debate in Part 8 of 10 of the debate transcript below.
Note: transcript portions are in topical order for clarity, but the posts are numbered to maintain chronological integrity. By the time I share Part 10 of this blog post series, I will have shared the entire debate transcript. All names are abbreviated for privacy and brevity.
Also note that MR's writings contain numerous spelling errors, but that is because English is not his primary language, as he mentioned in his first comment in Part 6 of the debate transcript. I say this to discourage unfair criticism of his writing ability.
56. MR:
And geology doesn’t work how you think: there are a lot of ways to found how much ancient is the geological strate in wich you found a fossil. The use of the decay of isotopes (there are a lot others than carbon 14, that work for ages well beyond the million of years ago) is one of the best ones. The fossil of ancient beeings aren’t compatible with the biblical flood 1 because that would have happened if anithing just a few of millenias ago, the majority of fossil are MILLION of years old when not BILLIONS, and 2 “casually” fossils of the some kind of ancient animal are always found in geological strates of the same age, and never in the “wrong strate”. What a coincidence, uh? Has I said, a rabbit (or even a t-rex, or any other dinosaur, or mammal, or bird) in the “wrong” strate would be enough to falsify Evolution. Strange how it never happen, considering that if the story of the flood is true, than we should found fossil of dinosaurs alongside with rabbits and any other exstinct animal of “other periods of time”, right?
And in the case you don’t know, a lot of ancient fossils are of marine creatures that can’t have died in the flood (well, some of them hypothetically could have died when the waters receeded, but that couldn’t have killed every one of their kind or even the majority of them, so they should be around still today. Wich they are not.)
58. Kevin:
“And geology doesn’t work how you think: there are a lot of ways to found how much ancient is the geological strate in wich you found a fossil. The use of the decay of isotopes (there are a lot others than carbon 14, that work for ages well beyond the million of years ago) is one of the best ones.”
Even radiometric dating relies on unverifiable assumptions: (1) the initial conditions of the rock sample regarding the amount of parent and daughter elements, (2) the quantities of parent and daughter elements were not somehow altered over time and (3) the decay rate was always constant. In fact, these assumptions have been proven to be incorrect with dating methods such as Argon-Argon and Postassium-Argon. “When muscovite (a common mineral in crustal rocks) is heated to 740°-860°C under high Ar pressures for periods of 3 to 10.5 hours it absorbs significant quantities of Ar, producing K-Ar ‘ages’ of up to 5 billion years, and the absorbed Ar is indistinguishable from radiogenic argon (40Ar*).”—Dr. Andrew Snelling (http://www.icr.org/article/potassium-dating-crystal-rocks-problem-excess-argo/). Moreover, when a team of scientists dated igneous rocks form the Grand Canyon using multiple dating methods, the different dating methods differed by “dates” of hundreds of millions of years! (https://answersingenesis.org/geology/radiometric-dating/rate-radioisotopes-and-the-age-of-the-earth/)
“The fossil of ancient beeings aren’t compatible with the biblical flood 1 because that would have happened if anithing just a few of millenias ago, the majority of fossil are MILLION of years old when not BILLIONS…”
How does one observe and verify the supposed fossil ages of millions and billions of years? This presupposes that the evolutionary worldview is true, but that begs the question. Also, as I briefly pointed out, radiometric dating is based on unverifiable (and often false) assumptions. Moreover, how can dinosaur fossils and fossils of other creatures be millions of years old when we often find soft tissue still preserved in them? (https://answersingenesis.org/dinosaurs/when-did-dinosaurs-live/solid-answers-soft-tissue/)
“…and 2 ‘casually’ fossils of the some kind of ancient animal are always found in geological strates of the same age, and never in the “wrong strate”. What a coincidence, uh? Has I said, a rabbit (or even a t-rex, or any other dinosaur, or mammal, or bird) in the “wrong” strate would be enough to falsify Evolution. Strange how it never happen, considering that if the story of the flood is true, than we should found fossil of dinosaurs alongside with rabbits and any other exstinct animal of “other periods of time”, right?”
As a matter of fact, there are numerous examples of this. Many modern birds have been found buried with dinosaurs including parrots, penguins, owls, sandpipers, albatross, flamingos, loons, ducks, cormorants, and avocets (see https://www.berkeley.edu/news/berkeleyan/1998/1118/fossil.html and https://creation.com/modern-birds-with-dinosaurs). Also, beaver-like creatures have been found buried with dinosaurs (Early Aquatic Mammal, Science 311 (5764): 1068, 24 February 2006), as well as badger-like creatures (Dinosaur-eating mammal discovered in China, www. nhm.ac.uk,14 January 2005). In fact, hundreds of mammal species have been found buried with dinosaurs (https://creation.com/werner-living-fossils). Most evolutionary timelines depict birds and mammals as living millions of years after dinosaurs, with just a few exceptions, so to find so many “modern” animals buried “out of place” with dinosaurs is a big problem for the evolutionary worldview.
“And in the case you don’t know, a lot of ancient fossils are of marine creatures that can’t have died in the flood (well, some of them hypothetically could have died when the waters receeded, but that couldn’t have killed every one of their kind or even the majority of them, so they should be around still today. Wich they are not.)”
How would you know that?
MR might have been in for a surprise when he saw my response to his claim that we never see fossilized creatures in the "wrong" strata. And yet, we do find numerous kinds of modern animals buried with dinosaurs. MR’s comment essentially put the ball on a tee for my rebuttal of both his comment and the evolutionary worldview as a whole. However, my purpose in defeating evolutionary arguments is not simply to win the argument. My ultimate purpose in engaging in these discussions is to increase faith in God’s Word and the Gospel. In this specific instance, my threefold prayer is that MR and other humanists (1) come to realize that God’s Word is absolutely true, (2) acknowledge their sinfulness before the holy God, and (3) realize their desperate need for the Savior.
I did not see any further responses from MR. After this discussion with MR, humanist RC reengaged and challenged me on why I choose the Bible over other "sacred texts." I will share that portion of the debate in my next post.